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I haven't kept up with what they've been doing in the past couple years but their business practices and after-sales support kinda sucked in the Miata tuning community.
 

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I'd like to see Air/fuel mixture data on this.
For $400 I'd rather get a PC5 from Rottweiler as soon as they get their dyno work done.

I wonder what the risk of the dealer wiping over the map is when you take it in for service or software updates.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
It does not make sense to me to buy piggy back devices when the ideal thing to do is reprogram the ECU. It’s all bypassing legal emissions requirements. So why is reprogramming the ECU not the preferred method?
 

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I'm not an expert but I trust Power commanders and I trust Rottweiler. What are these guys doing to fueling? Ignition advance? Throttle mapping?
If I need to remove a PC5 completely for some reason it's completely un-doable with no evidence that it was ever there. This is not the case with a hacked map load. And, as I said, there is a risk that the dealer wipes over it.
Also, if, in the future, you decide to change your system e.g. change slip-on, get a full system, etc. you can load a new map. If you move to a different elevation, you can get it remapped. If you really want, you can have a custom map done.
You can have two maps loaded and switch between them on the fly.

An ECU reflash is just as illegal as a Power Commander regarding emissions in states where such things are issues.
 

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For me the best takeaway is there is potentially more power lurking in there if you don't worry about the Euro 5 emissions compliance. The gains look significant and it looks like there is a nice bit of smoothing going on. The extra RPM up top could be handy at times. So if Openflash can do it, I would hope Rottweiler can as well.
 

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ECU flashing boarders on the esoteric. Not all flashers are created equal. Some guys are just basement dwellers that are good with a keyboard while others are true professional tuners with all the proper skills and equipment.

I have had flashes done on several bikes with mixed results. The two best results were done at the same shop by a guy named Steve Sefsick who started Shoodaben Engineering.

The first one Steve did was a Kawi Connie 14 and the result was nothing short of amazing. Although the Connie had a 1350cc motor it was really sleepy off bottom end and mid range plus had a snatchy throttle response. The new flash totally transformed the bike. Low and mid range power was completely woken up making the bike a sheer delight to ride.

The other bike was a Kawi Versys 650. While the result was not as dramatic as the Connie it still was a very noticeable improvement over the stock flash.

While Steve does dyno tuning paying close attention to A/F ratios, his goal is not max HP but rather better rideability. Because we spend so much time riding in the mid range power band, this is where Steve spends most of his time to get things just right. If he had a flash available for the Duke I would send him my ECU in a heartbeat.
 

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New here, just put a deposit on a new 890 yesterday, excited for the spring.
Not sure how the openflash is on the KTM but I got a custom tune for my car and it’s wonderful. A bit of a power bump and added the crackles and pops on overrun but they really worked with me to tune out the twitchy throttle that the 458’s are known for. They were a bit slow at times to respond but well worth it.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
New here, just put a deposit on a new 890 yesterday, excited for the spring.
Not sure how the openflash is on the KTM but I got a custom tune for my car and it’s wonderful. A bit of a power bump and added the crackles and pops on overrun but they really worked with me to tune out the twitchy throttle that the 458’s are known for. They were a bit slow at times to respond but well worth it.
Interesting. Will you do the 890?

What accessories are you planning on getting?
 

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Interesting. Will you do the 890?

What accessories are you planning on getting?
I’ll ride it for a bit first and see how it goes.
Going to do the tech pack and cruise control, the seat felt hard on the short test ride so might get the ergo seat and a slip on can.
 

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I'd like to see Air/fuel mixture data on this.
For $400 I'd rather get a PC5 from Rottweiler as soon as they get their dyno work done.

I wonder what the risk of the dealer wiping over the map is when you take it in for service or software updates.
Rottweiler’s been saying that for two years
Consider the Coober. Austrian made close work with KTM. nice GP and torque gains and smooths delivery.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I will be working with OpenFlash next week on a Streetfighter V4 project. He also says he has an 890 map he’s developed. I’m debating taking my 790 up to his shop in the spring.
Just coincidence? I assume you will evaluate their methods. It will be interesting to see how good they are.
 

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Just coincidence? I assume you will evaluate their methods. It will be interesting to see how good they are.
I contacted him a couple of months ago about the 790 Andretti seeing a post about his 890. A few weeks ago, he contacted me about the SF V4.
 

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I bet it will be a blast with the de restricted Duc SF!

Never have I considered flashing before, the power commander often sufficed.

Then when I bought my most recent moto, the Honda CBR SP, and learned that the PC was basically pointless wt the Ride By Wire throttle, as well as the fact all the restrictions, (mainly noise, emissions), were embedded within the ECU, did I learn that flashing, was a simple, yet complete alternative.

I worked with Dano’s Performance in California, a 2 decade + superbike engine builder and tuner, (I believe he only tunes the 4 Japanese brands, so this isn’t a plug, just sharing an experience).

Definitely go with a tuner with a great reputation.

I am told the Duc‘s come heavily restricted, can’t wait to read about it. I am sure the experience will benefit your 790 as well!
 

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I worked with Dano’s Performance in California, a 2 decade + superbike engine builder and tuner, (I believe he only tunes the 4 Japanese brands, so this isn’t a plug, just sharing an experience).

Definitely go with a tuner with a great reputation.

I am told the Duc‘s come heavily restricted, can’t wait to read about it. I am sure the experience will benefit your 790 as well!
Hey JD could you tell us more about Dano's flash?

Is it a full re-map changing many parameters like A/F ratios and ignition timing?

Would also love to hear about rideability. Did you notice any increase of low and mid range power?

Cheers
 

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Hey JD could you tell us more about Dano's flash?

Is it a full re-map changing many parameters like A/F ratios and ignition timing?

Would also love to hear about rideability. Did you notice any increase of low and mid range power?

Cheers
Sure, I just don't want to take this thread away from it's initial post. 🤓

To be straight, most all new SuperBikes come super restricted. Honda did this via their RBW throttle/ecu, basically nerfing power all through the rev range, choppy throttle, QS not very smooth, way down on torque & HP throughout the rev range.

Also, the rev limit/torque basically ran out at 10,500 rpms.

Dan released the full powah. Greater Tq & HP throughout the rev range, as well as a big hit up top, (20hp wt slip-on), and full power from 10,500-13,000 rpm's. This brings the ECU back to what they get in Europe, from the get-go, plus some more, so it's not over-revving or set up passed it's proper range.

Dan is a Super nice fella, and easy to talk to, I still chat with him about forum stuff.

He's a long-term forum sponsor on my other forum, 1000RR.net. His Ebay feedback is really what sold me.

Danos Performance: ECU Flash | Honda CBR 1000RR Forums

My review: Dano’s Performance | Honda CBR 1000RR Forums
 

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One CAVEAT about FLASHING - at least that I have read. The reflash is ALWAYS a secondary FLASH - the original stays in there. And if a dealer has to apply a factory reflash - it will wipe the custom one as well. Depending on your locality and the Flash guy this COULD become an issue.

And I'm with @Hawkerjet on this. Some bikes are more restricted at factory than others - so can see some monster gains. It's rideability that matters for 90% of us.

I had a 1997 Buell S3T - a 50cent part and a simple jet kit recovered 30% torque that had been dialed out for Swiss noise laws. Right smack in the 45-90mph area in top. 118dB though the Vance&Hines at full chat. And though an unfortunate set of circumstances (for the police) was legalized.
My R3 was easily upped by about 40hp changing inlet plenums and exhaust. Not legally so mind!.

But the 790 seems to be designed differently.
And part of the whole 790/890 thing is also due to tuning for EU4 and EU5.
 

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But the 790 seems to be designed differently.
And part of the whole 790/890 thing is also due to tuning for EU4 and EU5.
First off I am completely satisfied with the power and delivery of my 790. The stock package has plenty of power.

While it's not as powerful as some bikes I have had, 1190 Adventure, Ninja 1000, and my buddies FZ-10, come to mind. It is hands down the most fun to ride. Koodos to KTM.

All this discussion raises the age old question...how much power do you really need?

Most of us guys tend to think that more and bigger is better. Just like a judge at a wet tee shirt contest, he's probably gonna vote for the girl with the biggest hooters.

Lazareth-LM-847.jpg
 

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...Just like a judge at a wet tee shirt contest, he's probably gonna vote for the girl with the biggest hooters.
And your point is?
 
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