[Djangofou]

Hey everyone! I’m new to this forum and i would like your feedback to help me with my decision!!
I felt in love with the 790 after test riding it!! Then came the 890 and everything i read about it is awesome but i also read a lot about having some reliability issues!! I know this is a ktm forum but what do you guys think of the new upgraded version of the yamaha mt09 sp model!! I prefer the style and look of the 890 but yamaha are super reliable bikes!!
Thank you

 

[Paul Rees]

Hey everyone! I’m new to this forum and i would like your feedback to help me with my decision!!
I felt in love with the 790 after test riding it!! Then came the 890 and everything i read about it is awesome but i also read a lot about having some reliability issues!! I know this is a ktm forum but what do you guys think of the new upgraded version of the yamaha mt09 sp model!! I prefer the style and look of the 890 but yamaha are super reliable bikes!!
Thank you

A couple of minor things fixed by dealer at first service. Other than that, not one problem in well over 20k (don’t
take too much notice of the cry babies on other forums). If you are happy with bland and boring, go ahead and buy the Jap bike (perhaps a slight exaggeration but the KTM will be miles more fun).

 

[Djangofou]

A couple of minor things fixed by dealer at first service. Other than that, not one problem in well over 20k (don’t
take too much notice of the cry babies on other forums). If you are happy with bland and boring, go ahead and buy the Jap bike (perhaps a slight exaggeration but the KTM will be miles more fun).

A couple of minor things fixed by dealer at first service. Other than that, not one problem in well over 20k (don’t
take too much notice of the cry babies on other forums). If you are happy with bland and boring, go ahead and buy the Jap bike (perhaps a slight exaggeration but the KTM will be miles more fun).

Yes i bet a lot of 890 owners have great experiences with their bike!! Thank you

 

[Fastfred]

I had a test ride on the Yam a few years ago, very quick but it felt like you were sitting on the headlight. The KTM is a better riding position and loads of fun regardless of whether 790 or 890. If you have the money buy the 890 but my 790 is fine for me.

 

[andreo]

I am in love with my 790. Such great bike! I can imagine 890 only can be better. Btw new yamaha looks really ugly to me. If you are going for the mt 09, go with 2020 version.

 

[Wavshrdr]

The new changes are a huge improvement on the MT09. I am a big Yamaha fan and have probably owned 30+ in my lifetime. They made a lot of the right changes on the new bike. I had the original version and it was a love hate relationship. It had a great motor, decent chassis but terrible suspension and the fuel injection wasn't dialed in very well. I am pretty sure it will be a very good bike but they made it uglier and that is coming from a 890R owner which isn't exactly the belle of the ball in the looks department.

I haven't ridden the new one but I would take it over the 790 but not the 890 and I'll tell you my rationale. In the motor department, the 890 will trail the MT at peak power and at higher PRMs. On a track the MT will likely pull the 890 at the end of a long straight. Where I prefer my power and where it is most usable on the street, is low to mid range. That is where the 890 is a pretty amazing bike. Brakes and chassis are clearly in the 890's favor. The 890 has some of the best brakes I've ever seen on a streetbike and I have 2 Ducatis and 2 BMWs (down from 3) in the garage. The brakes on the 890 are stellar. Suspension on the 890 is very good. I can guarantee the stock Yami suspenders aren't going to be at the level of the 890. I am a big guy on on my MT, I always felt like I looked like a monkey blanking a football. I was always wadded up and uncomfortable. Apparently Austrians and taller and lankier than their Asian counterparts. Who woulda thunk?!?!

One thing I'd like to focus on a bit more is engine design. I grew up on 2-strokes and 4-strokes, singles, parallel twins, v-twin, v-4s, square 4's, triples, sixes and rotaries. I am now over 50 years of riding and the motor designs that do it the most for me are twins and sixes (other than a square 4 t-stroke I keep). If they made 2 stroke street bikes again with a big bore, I'd be first in line but they don't, so back to twins and sixes. There is something about the firing order and power delivery of the 890R. It is very tractable and has pretty good top end pull but won't rev to the moon like a 4 or 6. But I am fine with that for most of my riding. The 270 degree firing order is the same on my 2020 Africa Twin (AT). The 890 and the AT are the bikes I ride for about 90% of my riding. Heck, they even did in my little Royal Enfield 650 and I might be addicted to that firing order now as 3 of my most fun bikes for every day riding have the same firing order.

The pull down lower and smoother than my v-twin Ducatis which start to buck and chudder below 3k with a load. Not as smooth as my Teutonic 4's or 6's which will pull from idle to redline in 6th pretty much but they have a lot of character. Not to mention they all get amazing mileage for the performance they deliver. I have found that for most of my riding (40-100mph) about 100 hp parallel twin with a 270 degree firing order seems to tick all the boxes for me. Good power where I need it, an interesting exhaust note, good economy, and an engaging character. I have much faster bikes but these twins are the ones I somehow end up riding when I go out to the garage. If I need a real adrenaline rush, I'll fire up my supercharged Kawisaki which will do rollon wheelies at 120 mph where the 890 is definitely running out of breath but the next 20 rides will be on one of the twins in the garage.

When I want to really want to hit the curves the 890 is the logical and amazing choice. If I had to keep only one bike out of the 13 currently in the garage, it would be a really tough choice between the 890R and the 2020AT. For me I can appreciate the new MT but wouldn't buy it. I don't need the extra topend pull of its motor (not like it is going to run away and hide either) and it won't handle, stop or be as comfortable as my 890 is. I'll live with the minimal reliability issues should they show up. So far nothing is a show stopper. I had a bunch of British bikes growing up and apparently they marked their territory by leaving a puddle of oil everywhere they stopped. I think it was the original British design for a constant loss oil system. I figured I never needed to change the oil as I was constantly putting fresh in...

 

[Djangofou]

I am in love with my 790. Such great bike! I can imagine 890 only can be better. Btw new yamaha looks really ugly to me. If you are going for the mt 09, go with 2020 version.

The SP is new for this year here in canada so i would definitely go with the 2021 SP model!!! I would get use to the headlight!! Comes woth up and down quickshifter and cruise control!! Same price as the “stock” 890 without all the extra packages

 

[Djangofou]

I had a test ride on the Yam a few years ago, very quick but it felt like you were sitting on the headlight. The KTM is a better riding position and loads of fun regardless of whether 790 or 890. If you have the money buy the 890 but my 790 is fine for me.

Yes i would definitely go with the 890!!!

 

[Djangofou]

The new changes are a huge improvement on the MT09. I am a big Yamaha fan and have probably owned 30+ in my lifetime. They made a lot of the right changes on the new bike. I had the original version and it was a love hate relationship. It had a great motor, decent chassis but terrible suspension and the fuel injection wasn't dialed in very well. I am pretty sure it will be a very good bike but they made it uglier and that is coming from a 890R owner which isn't exactly the belle of the ball in the looks department.

I haven't ridden the new one but I would take it over the 790 but not the 890 and I'll tell you my rationale. In the motor department, the 890 will trail the MT at peak power and at higher PRMs. On a track the MT will likely pull the 890 at the end of a long straight. Where I prefer my power and where it is most usable on the street, is low to mid range. That is where the 890 is a pretty amazing bike. Brakes and chassis are clearly in the 890's favor. The 890 has some of the best brakes I've ever seen on a streetbike and I have 2 Ducatis and 2 BMWs (down from 3) in the garage. The brakes on the 890 are stellar. Suspension on the 890 is very good. I can guarantee the stock Yami suspenders aren't going to be at the level of the 890. I am a big guy on on my MT, I always felt like I looked like a monkey blanking a football. I was always wadded up and uncomfortable. Apparently Austrians and taller and lankier than their Asian counterparts. Who woulda thunk?!?!

One thing I'd like to focus on a bit more is engine design. I grew up on 2-strokes and 4-strokes, singles, parallel twins, v-twin, v-4s, square 4's, triples, sixes and rotaries. I am now over 50 years of riding and the motor designs that do it the most for me are twins and sixes (other than a square 4 t-stroke I keep). If they made 2 stroke street bikes again with a big bore, I'd be first in line but they don't, so back to twins and sixes. There is something about the firing order and power delivery of the 890R. It is very tractable and has pretty good top end pull but won't rev to the moon like a 4 or 6. But I am fine with that for most of my riding. The 270 degree firing order is the same on my 2020 Africa Twin (AT). The 890 and the AT are the bikes I ride for about 90% of my riding. Heck, they even did in my little Royal Enfield 650 and I might be addicted to that firing order now as 3 of my most fun bikes for every day riding have the same firing order.

The pull down lower and smoother than my v-twin Ducatis which start to buck and chudder below 3k with a load. Not as smooth as my Teutonic 4's or 6's which will pull from idle to redline in 6th pretty much but they have a lot of character. Not to mention they all get amazing mileage for the performance they deliver. I have found that for most of my riding (40-100mph) about 100 hp parallel twin with a 270 degree firing order seems to tick all the boxes for me. Good power where I need it, an interesting exhaust note, good economy, and an engaging character. I have much faster bikes but these twins are the ones I somehow end up riding when I go out to the garage. If I need a real adrenaline rush, I'll fire up my supercharged Kawisaki which will do rollon wheelies at 120 mph where the 890 is definitely running out of breath but the next 20 rides will be on one of the twins in the garage.

When I want to really want to hit the curves the 890 is the logical and amazing choice. If I had to keep only one bike out of the 13 currently in the garage, it would be a really tough choice between the 890R and the 2020AT. For me I can appreciate the new MT but wouldn't buy it. I don't need the extra topend pull of its motor (not like it is going to run away and hide either) and it won't handle, stop or be as comfortable as my 890 is. I'll live with the minimal reliability issues should they show up. So far nothing is a show stopper. I had a bunch of British bikes growing up and apparently they marked their territory by leaving a puddle of oil everywhere they stopped. I think it was the original British design for a constant loss oil system. I figured I never needed to change the oil as I was constantly putting fresh in...

2021 SP comes with the same electronics, has up/down quickshifter and has cruise control standard!! 13k here in canada!! Same price for the 890 but without all the extra packages!! And i don’t know how much those extra cost here in canada!! For the moment all dealers are closed!but yeah the 890 is #1 in my list!! Thank you

 

[Lonster]

The 890 is lighter, thinner, has WAY better brakes, better tires, better chassis specs (which give it the better handling) and better torque (performance from 0-100). The 890 Duke R also gets 20% better fuel economy over the MT09. The MT09SP has a place in peoples garages, but will be another second place bike when compared to the Super Scalpel in tests.

 

[Lonster]

Quote from MT09 review: "The 2021 Yamaha MT-09 starts at $9399, which is $400 more than the 2020 model. The 2021 MT-09 SP starts at $10,999. That extra $1600 represents a 17% premium over the base MT-09. So, is it worth it? "
Just adding some perspective to the debate. Sounds a LOT like the 790Duke vs 890Duke R debate to me.

 

[Djangofou]

Quote from MT09 review: "The 2021 Yamaha MT-09 starts at $9399, which is $400 more than the 2020 model. The 2021 MT-09 SP starts at $10,999. That extra $1600 represents a 17% premium over the base MT-09. So, is it worth it? "
Just adding some perspective to the debate. Sounds a LOT like the 790Duke vs 890Duke R debate to me.

1600$ you get suspension upgrades, cruise controle, 6 imu and up/down quickshifter! Although the quickshifter may also be standard with the base mt09 model!!
I’m waiting on after ride reviews of the new mt09 sp and comparisons about the SP and the super scalpel!!

 

[Hawkerjet]

I bought a new 2020 790 on Halloween day and now have 1800 miles on it. Hands down the most fun street bike I have ever owned. Every ride has me falling more and more in love with it.

Back in 2014 I bought a new FZ09 and put 24k miles on it before selling it. I spent 2k dollars on suspension upgrades and it still did not handle as well as my bone stock 790. Although it had more top end power than my 790 it was not even close to the 790 when it comes to character and easy rideability.

The chassis and ergo's are far better on the 790.

There were some issues with the FZ09. Cam chain tensioner was revised a couple of times and the clutch basket was weak and would shed pieces.

Get the 890 cuz you will not be disappointed.

 

[Djangofou]

I bought a new 2020 790 on Halloween day and now have 1800 miles on it. Hands down the most fun street bike I have ever owned. Every ride has me falling more and more in love with it.

Back in 2014 I bought a new FZ09 and put 24k miles on it before selling it. I spent 2k dollars on suspension upgrades and it still did not handle as well as my bone stock 790. Although it had more top end power than my 790 it was not even close to the 790 when it comes to character and easy rideability.

The chassis and ergo's are far better on the 790.

There were some issues with the FZ09. Cam chain tensioner was revised a couple of times and the clutch basket was weak and would shed pieces.

Get the 890 cuz you will not be disappointed.

That’s probably what I’m going to do!! The 890 is #1 on my list! Thank you

 

[Squid]

The 2021 upgrades on the MT-09 really seem interesting. The outgoing model was just disappointing apart from the gem of an engine, but to me it seems Yamaha have addressed all the issues. I'd need to see (or better yet do) a proper comparison before I'd be able to give proper feedback, but these are my educated guesses:

Chassis & Suspension: I expect the Yamaha be a lot better than it used to be. The chassis itself wasn't that bad on the old one, but the suspension was a letdown. Despite SP's Öhlins shock I expect the Yamaha to be second to KTM on this department. Yamaha tends to play it safer, whereas the KTM is a very focused cornering machine.

Engine: On paper they're very close, the KTM having a bit of an advantage regarding torque. If Yamaha have managed to keep the engine character (which I expect they have), Yamaha will be more enjoyable, although KTM is a lot of laughs too.

Brakes: The 890 will be better as I don't think the MT-09 had any other upgrades than brake pump.

Electronics: On paper they're similar, but I expect the KTM's more modern system to perform better. Mind you the Tech Pack accessory (quickshifter, track mode, adjustable TC etc) is more or less a must-have for the KTM – without it, the Yamaha has the edge.

Comfort & Ergos: Yamahas tend to have cramped ergos. If you're fine with that, I expect Yamaha with its rear suspension linkage to be more comfortable. The KTM is very spaceous and overall not bad comfort-wise either, if you don't mind the firm ride. The KTM ergos are actually really good, they work both on active riding and relaxed cruising.

Reliability: KTM have had their problems, but according to a recent long test report by the German mag Motorrad, they've all been addressed. Also the engine of their 790 was basically as new after 50kkm when they dismantled and inspected it. Yamaha haven't had any issued with the MT-09 as far as I know. Tie?

Price: At least over here the Yamaha is cheaper and it clearly gives more for your buck as you get a lot of stuff that you need to pay extra with KTM.

I don't think either will be a bad choice. I'm still happy with mine, and although I expect a massive improvement on the Yam, I don't think it will be as appealing to me as the 890.

 

[Bill]

The new changes are a huge improvement on the MT09. I am a big Yamaha fan and have probably owned 30+ in my lifetime. They made a lot of the right changes on the new bike. I had the original version and it was a love hate relationship. It had a great motor, decent chassis but terrible suspension and the fuel injection wasn't dialed in very well. I am pretty sure it will be a very good bike but they made it uglier and that is coming from a 890R owner which isn't exactly the belle of the ball in the looks department.

I haven't ridden the new one but I would take it over the 790 but not the 890 and I'll tell you my rationale. In the motor department, the 890 will trail the MT at peak power and at higher PRMs. On a track the MT will likely pull the 890 at the end of a long straight. Where I prefer my power and where it is most usable on the street, is low to mid range. That is where the 890 is a pretty amazing bike. Brakes and chassis are clearly in the 890's favor. The 890 has some of the best brakes I've ever seen on a streetbike and I have 2 Ducatis and 2 BMWs (down from 3) in the garage. The brakes on the 890 are stellar. Suspension on the 890 is very good. I can guarantee the stock Yami suspenders aren't going to be at the level of the 890. I am a big guy on on my MT, I always felt like I looked like a monkey blanking a football. I was always wadded up and uncomfortable. Apparently Austrians and taller and lankier than their Asian counterparts. Who woulda thunk?!?!

One thing I'd like to focus on a bit more is engine design. I grew up on 2-strokes and 4-strokes, singles, parallel twins, v-twin, v-4s, square 4's, triples, sixes and rotaries. I am now over 50 years of riding and the motor designs that do it the most for me are twins and sixes (other than a square 4 t-stroke I keep). If they made 2 stroke street bikes again with a big bore, I'd be first in line but they don't, so back to twins and sixes. There is something about the firing order and power delivery of the 890R. It is very tractable and has pretty good top end pull but won't rev to the moon like a 4 or 6. But I am fine with that for most of my riding. The 270 degree firing order is the same on my 2020 Africa Twin (AT). The 890 and the AT are the bikes I ride for about 90% of my riding. Heck, they even did in my little Royal Enfield 650 and I might be addicted to that firing order now as 3 of my most fun bikes for every day riding have the same firing order.

The pull down lower and smoother than my v-twin Ducatis which start to buck and chudder below 3k with a load. Not as smooth as my Teutonic 4's or 6's which will pull from idle to redline in 6th pretty much but they have a lot of character. Not to mention they all get amazing mileage for the performance they deliver. I have found that for most of my riding (40-100mph) about 100 hp parallel twin with a 270 degree firing order seems to tick all the boxes for me. Good power where I need it, an interesting exhaust note, good economy, and an engaging character. I have much faster bikes but these twins are the ones I somehow end up riding when I go out to the garage. If I need a real adrenaline rush, I'll fire up my supercharged Kawisaki which will do rollon wheelies at 120 mph where the 890 is definitely running out of breath but the next 20 rides will be on one of the twins in the garage.

When I want to really want to hit the curves the 890 is the logical and amazing choice. If I had to keep only one bike out of the 13 currently in the garage, it would be a really tough choice between the 890R and the 2020AT. For me I can appreciate the new MT but wouldn't buy it. I don't need the extra topend pull of its motor (not like it is going to run away and hide either) and it won't handle, stop or be as comfortable as my 890 is. I'll live with the minimal reliability issues should they show up. So far nothing is a show stopper. I had a bunch of British bikes growing up and apparently they marked their territory by leaving a puddle of oil everywhere they stopped. I think it was the original British design for a constant loss oil system. I figured I never needed to change the oil as I was constantly putting fresh in...

Lot of great info in there, thanks, I actually looked at the MT but I'm glad I went with the 790 I'm six foot one 270 and it pulls me great but I would like a little more so I'm thinking of going to an 890 or 1290 actually looked at the MT-10 thought it was kind of cool looking but like you said I don't need that top end. I like the low end punch too.

 

[Djangofou]

The 2021 upgrades on the MT-09 really seem interesting. The outgoing model was just disappointing apart from the gem of an engine, but to me it seems Yamaha have addressed all the issues. I'd need to see (or better yet do) a proper comparison before I'd be able to give proper feedback, but these are my educated guesses:

Chassis & Suspension: I expect the Yamaha be a lot better than it used to be. The chassis itself wasn't that bad on the old one, but the suspension was a letdown. Despite SP's Öhlins shock I expect the Yamaha to be second to KTM on this department. Yamaha tends to play it safer, whereas the KTM is a very focused cornering machine.

Engine: On paper they're very close, the KTM having a bit of an advantage regarding torque. If Yamaha have managed to keep the engine character (which I expect they have), Yamaha will be more enjoyable, although KTM is a lot of laughs too.

Brakes: The 890 will be better as I don't think the MT-09 had any other upgrades than brake pump.

Electronics: On paper they're similar, but I expect the KTM's more modern system to perform better. Mind you the Tech Pack accessory (quickshifter, track mode, adjustable TC etc) is more or less a must-have for the KTM – without it, the Yamaha has the edge.

Comfort & Ergos: Yamahas tend to have cramped ergos. If you're fine with that, I expect Yamaha with its rear suspension linkage to be more comfortable. The KTM is very spaceous and overall not bad comfort-wise either, if you don't mind the firm ride. The KTM ergos are actually really good, they work both on active riding and relaxed cruising.

Reliability: KTM have had their problems, but according to a recent long test report by the German mag Motorrad, they've all been addressed. Also the engine of their 790 was basically as new after 50kkm when they dismantled and inspected it. Yamaha haven't had any issued with the MT-09 as far as I know. Tie?

Price: At least over here the Yamaha is cheaper and it clearly gives more for your buck as you get a lot of stuff that you need to pay extra with KTM.

I don't think either will be a bad choice. I'm still happy with mine, and although I expect a massive improvement on the Yam, I don't think it will be as appealing to me as the 890.

Wow very good comparison!! Thank you very much!!! I’ll wait for a comparison of both bike and make a choice after!! It will all depend on how much the exra packages cost with ktm! They all come std with the new SP!

 

[Wavshrdr]

@Bill - I am a bigger guy than you and the 890 pulls me very well. Can't say that very often I am really wanting more power unless I am up in the triple digit range (MPH). That is where I think the 1290 is better but I spend such a small portion of my time at those speeds on the street anyway as I like to stay out of jail. As I've mentioned in other posts, according to KTM test riders, the 890R lapped some of their test tracks quicker than the 1290 SDR. That is pretty impressive.

@Djangofou - one nice thing about the packages, is you can get only what you want, and add it later if you decide you want it. I don't believe the Yamaha offers an actual track pack. If the cruise for the North American markets, is like the Euro one, the cruise doesn't work until you are at least 30 mph in 4th gear and up. The TFT screen is tiny, much smaller than the one on the 890R. You also have to spring for the SP version if you want cruise. Apparently they shrunk the wheelbase too. Will make it even more wheelie prone. For me the most interesting news out of Yamaha is they've been working on a turbo version of their bikes. Supposedly they had a test mule with the MT09 motor but they can't easily make into a street version but will probably due it on the MT10. Put it in a bigger chassis for a larger guy and I'd definitely consider selling my H2 Kawi as I like turbos better than superchargers.

 

[Hawkerjet]

Oops made a mistake.

 

[Hawkerjet]

Comfort & Ergos: Yamahas tend to have cramped ergos. If you're fine with that, I expect Yamaha with its rear suspension linkage to be more comfortable. The KTM is very spaceous and overall not bad comfort-wise either, if you don't mind the firm ride. The KTM ergos are actually really good, they work both on active riding and relaxed cruising.

Reliability: KTM have had their problems, but according to a recent long test report by the German mag Motorrad, they've all been addressed. Also the engine of their 790 was basically as new after 50kkm when they dismantled and inspected it. Yamaha haven't had any issued with the MT-09 as far as I know. Tie?

Having owed an early FZ09 for a couple of years and 24000 miles these are my thoughts on a couple of issues.

It's been a while since I had my FZ09 but don't remember it being more cramped than my 790.The FZ had less forward bias then the 790 and was in fact a bit more comfortable. The ride on my 790 is far more plush than the FZ. This was even after spending $2000 in upgrades. Premium fork cartridges and a Penski shock and trying a variety of suspension setup's.

The early FZ09's had cam chain tensioner problems and had several "upgrades" that never really solved the problem. Then there were the clutch baskets that would shed fingers. I don't know if either of these were ever resolved.

Another big issue for me was the terrible snatchy throttle. Subsequent ECU flashes helped some but they never were able to achieve a smooth throttle. The 790 hit it out of the park on this regard. I have owned several ride by wire bikes and the KTM is hands down the finest throttle by wire I have ever ridden.